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AWAC 2014-2015 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE) - UniLang

AWAC 2014-2015 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

This forum is for the Total Annihilation Challenge. See the sticky thread for more information.

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Youngfun
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AWAC 2014-2015 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Youngfun » 2014-09-17, 17:25

Since 2014 is almost at the end, this is my Autumn Annihilation Challenge 2014.

Now even Youngfun has a [reduced] TAC. I decided to start it because... otherwise wtf am I doing here on Unilang? Only to troll and write bad quality posts about languages or to chitchat? No! If I'm here, I have to actively learn a little bit of languages, right?

I chose these languages only because I have books about them (all in Chinese) in my room, so I'm learning all of them through Mandarin. except one, for now.

Esperanto
Goal (changed):
1. finish the book Manuale di Esperanto by Bruno Migliorini
2. (maybe) learn some more vocabulary from the book "世界语100句" (100 Esperanto sentences).
So it's more of a phrasebook than a real language course. Not something a Unilanger would use.
Moreover, it's a lame overrated aux-lang. Most Unilangers don't like it.
Conclusion: I'm a noob.


Japanese
Goal: try to learn something from the book "标准日本语" (Standard Japanese), the one used on the Japanese class at my university. At least learn the kana syllabaries and really basic things.

Cantonese
Goals:
1. finish the book "粤语入门速成班" (Introductory intensive course of Cantonese).
2. convert the lousy Canton romanization used in the book to Jyutping
3. try to understand something in HK TVB dramas.
Last edited by Youngfun on 2014-12-21, 9:34, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby vijayjohn » 2014-09-17, 19:17

Youngfun wrote:Now even Youngfun has a [reduced] TAC. I decided to start it because... otherwise wtf am I doing here on Unilang? Only to troll and write bad quality posts about languages or to chitchat? No! If I'm here, I have to actively learn a little bit of languages, right?

No. Not everybody does that here. :)
So it's more of a phrasebook than a real language course. Not something a Unilanger would use.

Are you kidding me? I fucking love (good) phrasebooks! It's just that there aren't any for a lot of the languages I'm learning now. :lol:
Moreover, it's a lame overrated aux-lang. Most Unilangers don't like it.

Maybe so, but I'd like to try it out some day, too. :)
At least learn the kana syllabaries

Both of them? I dunno, man, learning both hiragana and katakana takes a pretty long time IME. Of course, it's up to you, but if I were you, I think I'd just try to learn hiragana first. :)
Cantonese
Goals:
1. finish the book "粤语入门速成班" (Introductory intensive course of Cantonese).
2. convert the lousy Canton romanization used in the book to Jyutping
3. try to understand something in HK TVB dramas.

Wow, that sounds awesome! Someday, I would like to be able to go up to a native speaker of Cantonese and say something to them in it well enough for them to say something nice about it. That's never happened to me before. :lol:
Last edited by vijayjohn on 2014-12-21, 23:12, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby dEhiN » 2014-09-18, 18:33

Sounds good Francesco!

Basica is learning Esperanto as well. His TAC.

As for kana, yeah it took me a bit to learn Hiragana, and I'm still stuck on Katakana :D. I use this resource for learning kana: Tae Kim's Guide to Japanese. There are links to practice sheets you can print out, which include stroke order and stuff.

Good luck! And you creating goals is making me think maybe I should do the same for all my 20 languages!
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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Koko » 2014-09-18, 21:10

The Kana is really only difficult if you trouble remembering stuff. If you do have trouble, like any person should do, just keep track of which letters you know and for the ones you need to practise, well, practise. Then keep keeping track so that you don't forget them. It may help that some hiragana look similar to their katakana counterparts. Also, note that ね is ne, れ is re and わ is wa; ぬ is nu, and め is me. These are the syllables that caused many in my Japanese class confusion.
 (it) Correggimi per favore (se lo sbaglio è grave, sennò non correggermi perché potrei correggermelo da solo)  (bg) Българският не е руски  (cs) Jsem krásný jazyk. :D ^^

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Youngfun » 2014-09-19, 2:57

vijayjohn wrote:Are you kidding me? I fucking love (good) phrasebooks! It's just that there aren't any for a lot of the languages I'm learning now. :lol:

OK OK. Maybe not you, but i thought Unilangers only use TY or Colloquial; and are more concerned with grammar than learning to say sentences. :lol:

For me, the Assimil's phrasebook on Brazilian Portuguese was really useful to learn the basics.

Maybe so, but I'd like to try it out some day, too. :)

I know, you'd like to try all the languages of the word. There isn't any language you dislike.


Really, kana takes time? Then I'm not the dumb one! :mrgreen: it's that here in China, they expect you to learn all the kana in the first 2 lessons, and then teach everything in kana, giving for granted that you learnt them to fluency. I remember in the class at college the teacher told me to form a sentence with a grammar structure but I couldn't. Then she told me to read a sentence, but I couldn't either. :( so shameful...

It's that the Chinese (me included) are accustomed to learn thousand of hanzi since they were children, so it's normal for them to learn like 50 kana in one week. But as I said before, I don't know why I can't learn the kana, even though I learnt thousands of hanzi as a child.


Thanks, dEhiN and Koko for your suggestions! very useful!

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby dEhiN » 2014-09-19, 4:56

Hanzi and kana are different! You may be used to learning thousands of hanzi, but at what rate did you learn them? (Ex: 50 every 2 weeks?)

Also, I wonder if kana being a true syllabary makes things a bit difficult. I learned the Latin alphabet (through English of course :D) as a child, so I don't remember how long it took. I learned the Tamil abugida as a teenager, and that didn't take too long. Well, at least not to be able to recall each letter/symbol after a slight pause. Even hangul is really easy! But maybe kana being a syllabary changes things.
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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby vijayjohn » 2014-09-19, 6:56

Youngfun wrote:it's that here in China, they expect you to learn all the kana in the first 2 lessons, and then teach everything in kana, giving for granted that you learnt them to fluency.

:shock: No wonder why the Indian uncles and aunties here (used to) think the Chinese are smarter than us! :lol: Over here, the Japanese teachers spend weeks teaching kana. I mean, they teach other stuff, too, but...a lot of class time is devoted to just practicing how to write them.

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby basica » 2014-09-19, 9:45

it's that here in China, they expect you to learn all the kana in the first 2 lessons


My old college had a similar requirement. I realise if you got things to do it's a bit of an effort but I learned both in a couple of hours, maybe not even that. I just did them row by row, then go back and do all the rows I had memorised up until that point. Just brute force it, I'm sure you'll get through :)
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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby voron » 2014-09-19, 12:50

Youngfun wrote:but i thought Unilangers only use TY or Colloquial; and are more concerned with grammar than learning to say sentences.

Definitely not me either. I have never used either TY or Colloquial (I mostly used books in Russian mainly because I could buy them in the printed form).

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Koko » 2014-09-20, 7:59

There's kana site (RealKana) that my Japanese teacher got us to practise our hiragana. It's really great, I'd assume. After the first couple of lessons with hiragana I already knew the whole chart \(^_^)/ ! so I wouldn't know if it helps. And my class definitely wasn't a good way to tell.

You pick the syllables you want to practise with and style (there's a cursive one which cn make it pretty tough), then click go and write in the roomaji.

Ooh! Some basics (things you should know if you want to tell your nationality): The first kanji we learned was 人 (jin/hito) "person." This is used to make nationalities: カナダ人 is Canadian (person), and so on. For you to say "I'm Chinese" you'd say 「(和は)ちゆうごく人です。」 [(watashi wa) chuugokujin desu]. イタリア人 is Italian: if you want to say "I'm (both) Italian and Chinese" you'd say 「(私は)イタリア人もちゆうごく人もです。」 The "…mo …mo" thing is something I learned on my Babymetal thread which means "both … and …" using the particle for "also" (も).

The "ha" (は) is used to indicate the topic and is actually "wa"; hence why the sentence looks like "watashi ha."

If it's clear you are talking about yourself (perhaps one asked "Doko no kata desu ka."), you can omit the pronoun "watashi" and just say (essentially) "Italian and Chinese is."
 (it) Correggimi per favore (se lo sbaglio è grave, sennò non correggermi perché potrei correggermelo da solo)  (bg) Българският не е руски  (cs) Jsem krásný jazyk. :D ^^

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Koko » 2014-09-20, 8:12

Youngfun wrote:Thanks, dEhiN and Koko for your suggestions! very useful!

どういたしまして!No problem! ^^ If you need help with Nihongo, I'll gladly share my limited knowledge.
 (it) Correggimi per favore (se lo sbaglio è grave, sennò non correggermi perché potrei correggermelo da solo)  (bg) Българският не е руски  (cs) Jsem krásný jazyk. :D ^^

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Youngfun » 2014-09-20, 10:55

dEhiN wrote:but at what rate did you learn them? (Ex: 50 every 2 weeks?)

About 10-20 characters per lesson. When in Italy I studied Chinese twice a week. But when going to China in summer I studied every day, so that meant 10-20 characters per day...

vijayjohn wrote::shock: No wonder why the Indian uncles and aunties here (used to) think the Chinese are smarter than us!

I don't know if smarter, but they arre definitely better at memorizing things than us raised in the West... It's the school that trains them to do that since they were children.

basica wrote:
it's that here in China, they expect you to learn all the kana in the first 2 lessons


My old college had a similar requirement. I realise if you got things to do it's a bit of an effort but I learned both in a couple of hours, maybe not even that. I just did them row by row, then go back and do all the rows I had memorised up until that point. Just brute force it, I'm sure you'll get through :)

Wow. :shock: You are Chinese. :mrgreen:

Koko wrote:There's kana site (RealKana) that my Japanese teacher got us to practise our hiragana. It's really great, I'd assume. After the first couple of lessons with hiragana I already knew the whole chart \(^_^)/ ! so I wouldn't know if it helps. And my class definitely wasn't a good way to tell.

Thanks, Koko!
How to say the nationality was easy. We have the same structure (country+人) in Chinese. :mrgreen:

_______________

Anyway, hopefully I will at last really start studying tonight... hopefully...

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby księżycowy » 2014-09-20, 12:51

Koko wrote:There's kana site (RealKana) that my Japanese teacher got us to practise our hiragana. It's really great, I'd assume. After the first couple of lessons with hiragana I already knew the whole chart \(^_^)/ ! so I wouldn't know if it helps. And my class definitely wasn't a good way to tell.

You pick the syllables you want to practise with and style (there's a cursive one which cn make it pretty tough), then click go and write in the roomaji.

Cool website.

It certainly saves making or downloading an anki deck for the kana. I was just going through the first three sets of hiragana for the fun of it, and I was able to recall quite a few of them. Certainly a good thing, considering I haven't looked at kana (or Japanese for that matter) in a while.
þūhte mē þæt ic gesāwe syllicre trēow on lyft lædan lēohte bewunden bēama beorhtost.

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Itikar » 2014-09-20, 19:47

Youngfun wrote:Most Unilangers don't like it.
Eh?
Image

Non so se tu sappia del corso gratuito di Bruno Migliorini. Sí, proprio di quel Bruno Migliorini.
Beh in caso tu non lo sapessi, ora lo sai. :)

Perciò pare proprio che il colmo per l'autore di un dizionario d'ortografia e pronunzia sia avere errori d'ortografia nell'edizione postuma di una sua opera! :lol:

Ciao France e buon divertimento!
Fletto i muscoli e sono nel vuoto!
All corrections are welcome and appreciated.

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby IpseDixit » 2014-09-20, 23:39

Youngfun wrote:Cantonese


Ed eccone un altro entrato nel tunnel delle lingue minoritarie. :lol:

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Youngfun » 2014-09-21, 15:21

Itikar wrote:
Youngfun wrote:Most Unilangers don't like it.
Eh?

Il tuo avatar in esperanto! :D

Non so se tu sappia del corso gratuito di Bruno Migliorini. Sí, proprio di quel Bruno Migliorini.
Beh in caso tu non lo sapessi, ora lo sai. :)

Grazie! Mi è parso molto utile e intuitivo questo corso, ho già dato una letta al primo capitolo.
Sì, sapevo che Bruno Migliorini era un esperantista. :)

IpseDixit wrote:
Youngfun wrote:Cantonese


Ed eccone un altro entrato nel tunnel delle lingue minoritarie. :lol:

Veramente ci sono fin dalla nascita, con la mia lingua madre. :lol:
Il cantonese è il catalano della Cina. :D

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby IpseDixit » 2014-09-21, 17:23

Youngfun wrote:Il cantonese è il catalano della Cina. :D


E il tibetano il basco della Cina? :P

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby Youngfun » 2014-09-22, 14:20

IpseDixit wrote:
Youngfun wrote:Il cantonese è il catalano della Cina. :D


E il tibetano il basco della Cina? :P

In realtà il tibetano è una lingua geneticamente vicina al cinese, visto che fanno parte delle lingue Sino-Tibetane. Poi ci sono tante di quelle lingue minoritarie, delle più disparate famiglie: Tai-kadai, Hmong-Mien, Altaica, Austroasiatica, Austronesiana, ecc.
Last edited by Youngfun on 2014-09-22, 14:22, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby IpseDixit » 2014-09-22, 14:22

Youngfun wrote:
IpseDixit wrote:
Youngfun wrote:Il cantonese è il catalano della Cina. :D


E il tibetano il basco della Cina? :P

In realtà il tibetano è una lingua geneticamente vicina al cinese, visto che fanno parte delle lingue Sino-Tibetane. Poi ci sono tante di quelle lingue minoritarie, delle più disparate famiglie: Tai-kadai, Hmong-Mien, Altaica, Austroasiatica, Mongolica, ecc.


E' vero, non ci avevo pensato :P, avevo pensato più alla collocazione geografica (tra i monti) :P

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Re: AAC 2014 - Youngfun (EO, JA, YUE)

Postby vijayjohn » 2014-09-22, 22:13

Il tibetano è lo svizzero tedesco della Cina. :D Il basco della Cina è l'oroqen. :para: :lol:


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