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Ka Papa ‘Ōlelo Hawai‘i (Hawaiian language course) - Page 3 - UniLang

Ka Papa ‘Ōlelo Hawai‘i (Hawaiian language course)

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Nohola
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Postby Nohola » 2006-10-01, 5:17

Mamo wrote:
Nohola wrote:
riki wrote:Tena koe Nohola!

He tika tau, kati te whakarongo atu ki a ia, no te mea, ka pahupahu whera ia i nga wa katoa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Your words are right on (concerning the flag)!

Mahalo e riki. I dunno why, but it's so difficult for me to understand Rapa. I hope you can understand Hawaiian better than I do Rapa. :lol:

He [s]pololeo[/s] pololei/polole'i/pololoi/pololo'i no 'oe. 'Oi aku ka 'ike pili i ke kumu o ka hae Hawai'i ma mua o ke kakau [s]na'au'ole[/s] na'auao 'ole. You are definitely right. Better to know about the origin of the flag than to write nonesense.


Ua kahiāuli 'ia nā ho'oponopono i nā 'olalau ma ke kala 'ōma'oma'o. He mau wahi pa'ewa kikokiko wale nō na'e paha ia mau mea.

The corrections are in green. These were probably just mere typos.

riki wrote:A, ua maopopo ia'u inaianei (or is it more normal to say i keia manawa??)


We do not have the word inaianei. It is proper to use the following:
I kēia manawa
I kēia wā
Ānō

auwe, i never realized I had typos. Mahalo no ka ho'oPOLOLEI 'ana. :D

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Nohola
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Postby Nohola » 2006-10-01, 5:26

riki wrote:hehe ko taku reo, ko te reo Maori o Aotearoa! (I'm Maori by the way :wink: )

'Ae, ua heluhelu au i kau mau ho'olaha ma ke forum 'e a'e, ko Maori wahi.

Yup, I read your posts in the other forum, the Maori one.

P.S., I hate, hate, HATE translation, esp. side by side. that's just me. But I understand for a place where people are learning, it's essential.
Last edited by Nohola on 2006-10-01, 14:21, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Christophers » 2006-10-01, 6:30

Nohola wrote:P.S., I hate, hate, HATE translation, esp. side by side. that's just me. But I understand for a place where people are learning, it's essential.


Bakit ba? Nakakatuwa naman, e! :-)
Why? It's fun! :-)
Pourquoi ? C'est ben le fun là ! :-)
¿Por qué? ¡Es muy divertido! :-)
Per què? És força divertit! :-)
なぜ?楽しいぞ!^_^

LOL

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Postby Mamo » 2006-10-01, 13:30

Nohola wrote:
riki wrote:hehe ko taku reo, ko te reo Maori o Aotearoa! (I'm Maori by the way :wink: )


'Ae, ua heluhelu au i kau mau ho'olaha ma ke forum 'e a'e, ko Maori wahi.

Yup, I read your posts in the other forum, the Maori one.

P.S., I hate, hate, HATE translation, esp. side by side. that's just me. But I understand for a place where people are learning, it's essential.


You actually don't have many typos at all. Your Hawaiian is very good. In terms of culture, I am not that strong. My skill is in the language, so that is all I can offer with any confidence to the people here. I think that you should post more about culture, because it is a valuable resource to everyone here.

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Nohola
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Postby Nohola » 2006-10-01, 14:33

Mamo wrote:You actually don't have many typos at all. Your Hawaiian is very good. In terms of culture, I am not that strong. My skill is in the language, so that is all I can offer with any confidence to the people here. I think that you should post more about culture, because it is a valuable resource to everyone here.

I mentioned cultural b/c of the words you use, many I've never come across before or at least in those forms, for a good reason. I'm not one of those immersion school students and my speech singles me out as an "old timer". I've learned to adapt and try to learn the new words that most of which you'll find in the Mamaka Kaiao dictionary, but I'm just too lazy to learn that type of vocabulary. Like the old timers, we use English. Even my Aunty Kauwila (of whom I learned Hawaiian from) use Bank if not Panako. What is the common term for bank today anyway? See, I won't even bother to look it up. :lol: I was brought up on hale mai vs. hale ma'i or today's haukapila. I think that's the term they use today, no?

I've also heard the argument of manaleo criticizing the young ones b/c it seems so...well, English. That I know I understand and I try to correct some of the young ones, but it does no good. But in my experience, their grammar is not that much like English really. Sometimes not very Hawaiian, but that's ok. They're understood. Then you have the Hilo Nazis (whom I admire btw :lol: ) and I know a 21 yr. old (cousin) who is kinda high makamaka w/ the language and criticizes too much. But I also warn him of the dialectal difference since olden days till present.

Having said all of that, I have noticed your translations and i personally don't like translations, literal ones mostly b/c when dealing with languages of totally different cultures, sometimes you can't translate. For example with the directionals, or references such as Kahikiku, Kahikimoe, Kahikikapakapa, etc. I even had one person ask how to translate "Daddy's girl" and someone responded with the LITERAL translation which was wrong of course, then I had to explain a Hawaiian concept and give them the correct term for it. This i why I mentioned cultural context, which I think is good and can introduce vocabulary that would be essential. But that's only my mana'o, not a correction or anything like that.

p.s. I normally go into forums, etc. under mamoahina but you already had Mamo so didn't want anything similar, so I opted to use our family name instead.

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Postby Mamo » 2006-10-01, 15:15

Nohola wrote:
Mamo wrote:You actually don't have many typos at all. Your Hawaiian is very good. In terms of culture, I am not that strong. My skill is in the language, so that is all I can offer with any confidence to the people here. I think that you should post more about culture, because it is a valuable resource to everyone here.

I mentioned cultural b/c of the words you use, many I've never come across before or at least in those forms, for a good reason. I'm not one of those immersion school students and my speech singles me out as an "old timer". I've learned to adapt and try to learn the new words that most of which you'll find in the Mamaka Kaiao dictionary, but I'm just too lazy to learn that type of vocabulary. Like the old timers, we use English. Even my Aunty Kauwila (of whom I learned Hawaiian from) use Bank if not Panako. What is the common term for bank today anyway? See, I won't even bother to look it up. :lol: I was brought up on hale mai vs. hale ma'i or today's haukapila. I think that's the term they use today, no?

I've also heard the argument of manaleo criticizing the young ones b/c it seems so...well, English. That I know I understand and I try to correct some of the young ones, but it does no good. But in my experience, their grammar is not that much like English really. Sometimes not very Hawaiian, but that's ok. They're understood. Then you have the Hilo Nazis (whom I admire btw :lol: ) and I know a 21 yr. old (cousin) who is kinda high makamaka w/ the language and criticizes too much. But I also warn him of the dialectal difference since olden days till present.

Having said all of that, I have noticed your translations and i personally don't like translations, literal ones mostly b/c when dealing with languages of totally different cultures, sometimes you can't translate. For example with the directionals, or references such as Kahikiku, Kahikimoe, Kahikikapakapa, etc. I even had one person ask how to translate "Daddy's girl" and someone responded with the LITERAL translation which was wrong of course, then I had to explain a Hawaiian concept and give them the correct term for it. This i why I mentioned cultural context, which I think is good and can introduce vocabulary that would be essential. But that's only my mana'o, not a correction or anything like that.

p.s. I normally go into forums, etc. under mamoahina but you already had Mamo so didn't want anything similar, so I opted to use our family name instead.


The words I used are not "new" words that are found exclusively in the Mamaka Kaiao. They are high-frequency words found in the Elbert and Puku'i Hawaiian Dictionary. It is awkward that you never came across them since they are very common and basic words, learned in the first year Hawaiian language classes.

Yes, haukapila and hale ma'i are fine for the word hospital.

Actually, the Hawaiian language you're talking about is very much like English, and it is not okay.

Whether or not you approve of translations of Hawaiian into English or English into Hawaiian is okay. If you don't want to translate anything, then you don't have to.

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Postby Nohola » 2006-10-01, 15:52

Mamo wrote:The words I used are not "new" words that are found exclusively in the Mamaka Kaiao. They are high-frequency words found in the Elbert and Puku'i Hawaiian Dictionary. It is awkward that you never came across them since they are very common and basic words, learned in the first year Hawaiian language classes.

Right, I understand that mamo. But I did not take Hawaiian from a Hawaiian langauge 101 class, that's why. Same goes for manaleo, they didn't learn certain words, like haukapila. That was the whole point, to make you understand that the people nowadays use certain words that have replaced words that we have used as in haukapila. I don't hear the young people use hale ma'i at all. And you misunderstood me when I was refering to words I've never come across before, but the point was is that your Hawaiian is good. I wasn't criticizing you or anything.

Whether or not you approve of translations of Hawaiian into English or English into Hawaiian is okay. If you don't want to translate anything, then you don't have to.

Correct. I was only giving you my mana'o, but I guess I should refrain from that from now on in the event that it may be misconstrued.

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Postby Ariki » 2006-10-02, 6:10

Kia ora korua,

Hm, Rarotongan uses 'Are maki, and Tahitian uses Fare ma'i. But do you think we'd use whare maki? Nope...the missionaries decided that hohipera/hohipere sound much nicer (evil missionaries :evil: ).

If your nick is Mamoahina, I think I've read your online blogs before?

I think it is wonderful that we two very competent speakers of Hawaiian here. Manaleo or not, the important think is the korero. As we say -

He mana ano to te kupu.

Words are powerful.

:) Noho ora mai korua. E kaikaha ana au e toku hoa, e Mamo, ki tau akomanga e whai ake nei. Kia tere, kei roki ke toku kaikaha :P lol
Linguicide IS genocide. :)

He ingoa ōpaki a Riki; he ingoa ōkawa a Ariki.

Riki is an informal name; Ariki is a formal name.

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Postby Ariki » 2006-10-02, 6:33

Oh, and Mamo, if you'd like, you can create another thread, perhaps a gone off topic thread or something, perhaps, a thread with the title - Contemporary issues with Hawai'ian language and its development since the time of the ancestors to the modern day (which is a lot more than what more forum has received. I'm letting it rest for awhile before I develope more things on it).

I feel if a thread like that was created, you could move all of these posts not directly related to the lessons in to there. If you need help, ask the powers that be to make me a temporary mod and I can do it with in the next few days.

Are we all pai with that?
Linguicide IS genocide. :)

He ingoa ōpaki a Riki; he ingoa ōkawa a Ariki.

Riki is an informal name; Ariki is a formal name.

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Postby Nohola » 2006-10-02, 13:02

riki wrote:Kia ora korua,

Hm, Rarotongan uses 'Are maki, and Tahitian uses Fare ma'i. But do you think we'd use whare maki? Nope...the missionaries decided that hohipera/hohipere sound much nicer (evil missionaries :evil: ).

If your nick is Mamoahina, I think I've read your online blogs before?

Or maybe some posts elsewhere? I'm wondering if you posted in some Maori forum before? I posted there and they had a Hawaiian section.

I think it is wonderful that we two very competent speakers of Hawaiian here. Manaleo or not, the important think is the korero. As we say -

I have to agree.

He mana ano to te kupu.

Words are powerful.

Speaking of, here are my favorite 'olelo no'eau regarding words of which I had to use to remind people when it came to co-opting our culture.

aia ke ola i ka waha, aia ka make i ka waha
life is in the mouth, death is in the mouth

i ka 'olelo no ke ola, i ka 'olelo no ka make
life is in the word, death is in the word

Both of these of course referring to mana that exists in everything that we say.
He manao oiwi!

E hoi e pee i ke opu weuweu me he moho la. E ao o hai ka pua o ka mauu ia oe

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Postby Nero » 2006-10-03, 0:20

riki wrote:Oh, and Mamo, if you'd like, you can create another thread, perhaps a gone off topic thread or something, perhaps, a thread with the title - Contemporary issues with Hawai'ian language and its development since the time of the ancestors to the modern day (which is a lot more than what more forum has received. I'm letting it rest for awhile before I develope more things on it).


I agree. Save the course thread for the course, instead of making a mess.

Mamo, I like the way you've laid out your lessons :waytogo:. I think I am falling in love with Hawaiian all over again :wink:
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Postby culúrien » 2006-10-03, 1:59

más frases (¡por divertido!)

Aloha kākou! ʻO wai kou inou? Pehea ʻoe? Maikaʻi nō au. ʻO Celebrian koʻu inoa. He haumana au. He haumana maikaʻi au? He hau ʻai kēnā. He hua ʻai huʻihuʻi. He manaʻo ʻono au!
استیسی

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Postby Ariki » 2006-10-05, 8:05

Aloha 'oe e Celebrian 23! 'O Riki kēia, 'o Riki kō'u inoa, pēhea 'oe i kēia manawa?'

He haumana ho'i wau, ke hō'a'o nei au i ke Kula Nui o Auckland, ke hō'a'o nei au i ka 'ōlelo Māori o Rarotonga.

I'm also a student, I study at Auckland University, I'm learning the Māori language of Rarotonga.

A hui hou!
Linguicide IS genocide. :)

He ingoa ōpaki a Riki; he ingoa ōkawa a Ariki.

Riki is an informal name; Ariki is a formal name.

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Postby Aleco » 2006-10-07, 9:03

A bit late, but the first excersises:
(I don't have the long vowel marks on this computer...)

1. He haumana 'aawiiwii 'o ia
2. He hua 'ai keenaa
3. He aha keelaa?
4. He mea inu hu'ihu'i keenaa
5. He maaka'i o' ia?
6. He mea 'ai 'ono keenaa?
7. He kumu maika'i keeia?
8. He ka'a maika'i keeia?
9. He kanaka 'aawiiwii 'oe
10. He kumu au

1. 'A'ole 'o ia he haumana 'aawiiwii
2. 'A'ole keenaa he hua 'ai
3. ?????
4. 'A'ole keenaa he mea inu hu'ihu'i
5. 'A'ole o' ia he maaka'i?
6. 'A'ole keenaa he mea 'ai 'ono
7. 'A'ole keeia he kumu maka'i
8. 'A'ole keeia he ka'a maka'i
9. 'A'ole 'oe he kanaka 'aawiiwii
10. 'A'ole au he kumu

1. He ka'a ike'ike keeia
2. He keiki au
3. Ke kanaka maka'u
4. 'A'ole keenaa 'ono
5. He kumu maika'i 'oe, Mamo!
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Postby Nero » 2006-10-13, 10:21

The Hawaiian flag looks good on the forums! I like it.
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Postby Mamo » 2006-10-17, 11:48

Aleco wrote:A bit late, but the first excersises:

[size=1]1. He haumana 'aawiiwii 'o ia
2. He hua 'ai keenaa
3. He aha keelaa?
4. He mea inu hu'ihu'i keenaa
5. He maaka'i [s]o' [/s]'o ia?
6. He mea 'ai 'ono keenaa?
7. He kumu maika'i keeia?
8. He ka'a maika'i keeia?
9. He kanaka 'aawiiwii 'oe
10. He kumu au

1. 'A'ole 'o ia he haumana 'aawiiwii
2. 'A'ole keenaa he hua 'ai
3. ?????
4. 'A'ole keenaa he mea inu hu'ihu'i
5. 'A'ole [s]o'[/s] 'o ia he maaka'i?
6. 'A'ole keenaa he mea 'ai 'ono.
7. 'A'ole keeia he kumu maka'i.
8. 'A'ole keeia he ka'a maka'i.
9. 'A'ole 'oe he kanaka 'aawiiwii.
10. 'A'ole au he kumu.

1. He ka'a [s]ike'ike[/s] ('ike'ike?: show/carnival) keeia.
2. He keiki au.
3. Ke kanaka maka'u.
4. 'A'ole keenaa he mea 'ono.
5. He kumu maika'i 'oe, Mamo!


All of the first section was correct, except in the instances where you placed placed the glottal stop after the o in 'o ia.

For the third section I will provide translations so that the meanings of the sentences can be understood given the format they've been written in. If the intended meaning is not what has been produced, the translation will give the student a chance to augment the sentence.

1. This is a show/carnival car.
2. I am a child.
3. The scared person.
4. That is not a tasty thing. (You can also say, " 'A'ole 'ono keenaa" - "That is not tasty").
5. You are a good teacher, Mamo.

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Aleco
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Postby Aleco » 2006-10-17, 14:55

This is a small car, I think I tried to write :oops:
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Postby Mamo » 2006-11-02, 8:23

Aleco wrote:This is a small car, I think I tried to write :oops:


Then you would have wanted to say:

He ka'a li'ili'i kēia.


I haven't had enough time to come up with lesson two. I'll try to write it up soon.

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Postby Ariki » 2006-11-02, 8:29

E te hoa, kua hoki mai na koe! Pewhea koe!!!!!!! Maika'i loa keia keiki, aka, ua mihimihi(???miss) loa aku nei au ia'oe, ua hau'oli ko'u nei na'au i kou ho'i 'ana mai!
Linguicide IS genocide. :)

He ingoa ōpaki a Riki; he ingoa ōkawa a Ariki.

Riki is an informal name; Ariki is a formal name.

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Postby Aleco » 2006-11-04, 13:47

Mamo wrote:
Aleco wrote:This is a small car, I think I tried to write :oops:


Then you would have wanted to say:

He ka'a li'ili'i kēia.


I haven't had enough time to come up with lesson two. I'll try to write it up soon.


haha, some words are so weird :lol:
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