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Discussion Group - Page 249 - UniLang

Discussion Group

Moderators: JackFrost, dEhiN

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby hashi » 2014-11-02, 22:20

Although to me if someone says graphic novel, I tend to think of something illustrated (along the lines of a comic book for example).

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby linguoboy » 2014-11-03, 1:11

IpseDixit wrote:In Italian we use the term "graphic novel" to refer to comic books which are supposed to be more highbrow, serious and deeper than usual comic books (I would say something like Persepolis for example).

The English term has those connotations as well, but there's also a distinction of manner of publishing. Graphic novels are often stand-alone monographs whereas comic books tend to be serial in nature. Persepolis, like Maus, was not serialised (although both spawned sequels). Most superhero comics, on the other hand, appear in monthly installments.

Of course, this distinction breaks down when serial issues are collected and bound in hardcover format. Sandman was serialised, but they later came out with several bound volumes each covering a major storyline, so I tend to refer to it as a "graphic novel". Same for Miller's The Dark Knight Returns, which originally appeared as a four-issue miniseries.
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Halfdan » 2014-11-03, 1:34

linguoboy wrote:Of course, this distinction breaks down when serial issues are collected and bound in hardcover format. Sandman was serialised, but they later came out with several bound volumes each covering a major storyline, so I tend to refer to it as a "graphic novel". Same for Miller's The Dark Knight Returns, which originally appeared as a four-issue miniseries.


Isn't a collection of serials called a trade paperback?

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby linguoboy » 2014-11-03, 1:39

Halfdan wrote:
linguoboy wrote:Of course, this distinction breaks down when serial issues are collected and bound in hardcover format. Sandman was serialised, but they later came out with several bound volumes each covering a major storyline, so I tend to refer to it as a "graphic novel". Same for Miller's The Dark Knight Returns, which originally appeared as a four-issue miniseries.

Isn't a collection of serials called a trade paperback?

Wikipedia wrote:Although trade paperback is actually a publishing term that refers to any book with a flexible cardstock cover which is larger than the standard mass market paperback format, comics fans unfamiliar with that meaning have come to use the term to refer to the type of material traditionally sold in comics shops in that format: collected editions of previously serialized stories. The term graphic novel is sometimes used interchangeably, but some people maintain that the terms are distinct, with the difference being that the latter term refers to a square-bound printing with largely original material.
I'm not a comic collector, I'm a librarian, so I would never use "trade paper(back)" in this restricted sense.
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby hashi » 2014-11-03, 20:14

Is it common to pronounce the word "us" as [ʌz]? There's someone at my work who pronounces it like this all the time (indiscriminate of position in the sentence). English is his first language, and I can't put it down to being an NZE thing as he's the only person I've ever heard do it. I'm more just wondering whether he's an anomaly, or whether it is sometimes pronounced this way.

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Lazar Taxon » 2014-11-03, 20:27

In the North of England, it's common to pronounce "us" as [ʊz]/[əz]. But I haven't heard of it occurring elsewhere.
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Ciarán12 » 2014-11-03, 21:33

Lazar Taxon wrote:In the North of England, it's common to pronounce "us" as [ʊz]/[əz]. But I haven't heard of it occurring elsewhere.


[ʊz] is a fairly common pronunciation among certain working class Dublin people, a friend of mine always pronounces it that way, as does his family. Also, I remember hearing a Scottish comedian pronouncing it that way, I think he was Glaswegian but I can't be sure.
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby hashi » 2014-11-03, 21:37

Hmmm that's interesting. Maybe he has relatives from those areas, but I'm not sure. I've tried asking him about it but he thinks he pronounces it the same as everyone else >.>. Although in every other way he sounds NZE. Maybe it's just a quirk.

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Koko » 2014-11-04, 0:35

Apparently Jesus and Moses are supposed to be pronounced like they were spelt Jesuz and Mosez :O I've always used the "hiss." All my friends say [dʒiːzəz] and [məʊzəz]. My fam says the names like me. Then I read a while ago that they should be how my friends pronounce them.

Sorry, [ʌz] reminded me of this.
 (it) Correggimi per favore (se lo sbaglio è grave, sennò non correggermi perché potrei correggermelo da solo)  (bg) Българският не е руски  (cs) Jsem krásný jazyk. :D ^^

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby IpseDixit » 2014-11-06, 11:25

So, I'm looking for an adjective to describe a book (but not necessarily just a book) whose themes are still an open issue in our times, even though the book was written many years ago.

For example:

The Iron Heel by Jack London was written in 1908 but it still is a very [???] book as it recounts the struggle of the people to bring down a ruthless oligarchy of the corporations.

In Italian we would say attuale - current, but to me current sounds a bit weird here.

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Lazar Taxon » 2014-11-06, 12:43

Hmm, I think I'd go with "relevant".

Also, I would change "it still is" to "it is still", and "a ruthless oligarchy of the corporations" to "a ruthless corporate oligarchy" (or maybe "the ruthless oligarchy of corporations").
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby IpseDixit » 2014-11-06, 14:11

Can't I use "it still is" to emphasize the fact that it is still relevant nowadays?

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Lazar Taxon » 2014-11-06, 16:03

It wouldn't be incorrect, but I think "it is still" would be the more typical wording. For example, "is still a very relevant book" gets many more Google hits than "still is a very relevant book".
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Koko » 2014-11-07, 7:27

Lazar, not I would be so sure. "Still" before any verb is quite normal in my dialect and I have seen it in novels I (and others) consider well-written.

You're absolutely right, Ipse, that it emphasizes the fact that it still is relevant. It's the equivalent to saying "it is still" and can further be stressed with "it still is."

Lazar, I wouldn't trust what Google has to say to the extent that you seem to put in it. Just look at Google translate: not the best option for full sentences no matter how convenient it may be. It gives me nothing on "to keep oneself <adj.>;" something I love dearly in literary English.
 (it) Correggimi per favore (se lo sbaglio è grave, sennò non correggermi perché potrei correggermelo da solo)  (bg) Българският не е руски  (cs) Jsem krásný jazyk. :D ^^

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Marah » 2014-11-11, 20:36

Would you say that overusing "..." gives non-native speakers away? As in "Yeah... I know what you mean... I'm also disappointed..." but when it happens quite frequently?

I have the impression that in French and some other languages we use it all the time, while in English rather less so.
Par exemple, l'enfant croit au Père Noël. L'adulte non. L'adulte ne croit pas au Père Noël. Il vote.

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby linguoboy » 2014-11-11, 20:50

Marah wrote:I have the impression that in French and some other languages we use it all the time, while in English rather less so.

Personally I hadn't considered that this might be a result of L2 interference. I see a lot of native speakers of English abuse the ellipsis as well.
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby hashi » 2014-11-11, 20:55

linguoboy wrote:
Marah wrote:I have the impression that in French and some other languages we use it all the time, while in English rather less so.

Personally I hadn't considered that this might be a result of L2 interference. I see a lot of native speakers of English abuse the ellipsis as well.


Uhh... what are you talking about...

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Re: Discussion Group

Postby TeneReef » 2014-11-12, 1:26

I've been reading some hypnotic sessions transcripts, and I find the language used very quirky.

Why do people use telegraphic English while hypnotized? :hmm:
:hmm:

Hypnotist: Describe me what you did yesterday.
Hypnotized person: Sunny day, driving to beach.
Hypnotist: Are you hot?
Hypnotized person: No, inside is cold, air con is on.

Would inside is cold be grammatical in normal speech? :hmm:
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby Dormouse559 » 2014-11-12, 1:32

It has a subject and a verb, so yeah. It sounds like a newspaper headline, and it would be better as "It's cold inside", but it's not wrong.
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Re: Discussion Group

Postby razlem » 2014-11-21, 3:02

In which American dialects would you hear /nju:/ (new)? Now that I think about it myself I can't pin it down to any specific region. Anyone happen to know?
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