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Levi's Questions - Page 7 - UniLang

Levi's Questions

Moderators: dEhiN, JackFrost

NickPR
Posts: 8
Joined: 2015-01-25, 2:52
Gender: male
Country: PL Poland (Polska)

Re: Levi's Questions

Postby NickPR » 2015-01-26, 18:03

Ok, which accent do you want to imitate? RP or GA?

Levike wrote:My problem is that I cannot hear the difference between those certain pairs when spoken. If I could then I would probably pronounce them correctly.

It's the other way around. You need to know how to pronounce these phonemes in order to hear the difference between them.

Levike wrote:Until now I think I've been pronouncing /ʌ/ and /ɒ/ as [ɒ].

 (en-uk) the first step to differentiate between those is lip rounding - /ʌ/ can't have any, while /ɒ/ is moderately rounded.

 (en-uk) /ʌ/ is central, like Romanian /a/, but slightly less open.
 (en-uk) /ɒ/ is fully back, like Romanian /o/, but slightly more open.

Some southern UK speakers use a more back /ʌ/, this is also common is Scotland, Norfolk and older speakers of RP. I have no evidence for this, but I suspect that /ʌ/ merges with /ɒ/ in some southern UK speakers, or will do so in the future.

Levike wrote:Probably because those are the sounds that Hungarian has.

But Standard Hungarian /ɛ/ is actually [æ], at least according to some sources. But maybe your dialect realizes it as [ɛ].

 (en-uk) /æ/: say Romanian /a/ (your mouth must be really open, more than it feels natural for you), keep the jaw in that position, and say Romanian /e/ without raising the front part of your tongue. There's RP /æ/.

Or maybe just record yourself.

User avatar
Levike
Posts: 3496
Joined: 2013-04-22, 19:26
Real Name: Levente
Gender: male
Location: Marosvásárhely
Country: RO Romania (România)

Re: Levi's Questions

Postby Levike » 2015-01-26, 18:14

NickPR wrote:Ok, which accent do you want to imitate? RP or GA?
British English please. :P

but I suspect that /ʌ/ merges with /ɒ/ in some southern UK speakers, or will do so in the future.
Wouldn't mind.

But Standard Hungarian /ɛ/ is actually [æ]
Wut? :shock:

/æ/: say Romanian /a/ (your mouth must be really open, more than it feels natural for you), keep the jaw in that position, and say Romanian /e/ without raising the front part of your tongue. There's RP /æ/.
That feels so weird.

Thank you very much.

I'll record myself in one of the following days, that'll do it.
Hungarian (hu) Nem egy nap alatt épült Buda vára. _______German (de) Wo ein Wille ist, da ist auch ein Weg.
English (en) Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. __Spanish (es) No hay ceguera peor que no querer mirar.
Romanian (ro) Nu întinde arcul până nu este bine aşezată săgeata.

NickPR
Posts: 8
Joined: 2015-01-25, 2:52
Gender: male
Country: PL Poland (Polska)

Re: Levi's Questions

Postby NickPR » 2015-01-26, 21:06

No problem.
Levike wrote:
But Standard Hungarian /ɛ/ is actually [æ]
Wut? :shock:

In other words, what is transcribed /ɛ/ in Standard Hungarian is, in fact, phonetically [æ], at least according to Szende (1994). Here's the Standard Hungarian vowel chart, from Szende (1994)
Image
Symbols between slashes = phonemic transcription: tired /ˈtaɪəd/
Symbols between square brackets = phonetic transcription: tired [ˈtˢʰäˑɪəd̥]

To see how great the discrepancy between phonemic symbols and the actual phonetic realizations of the sounds they represent can be, take a look at the Danish vowel chart:
Image
I'll explain what I mean: front vowels /e ɛ æ a/ are actually [e̝ e ɛ æ], back vowels /ɔ ɒ/ are actually [ɔ̝̈ ɔ], and /ʌ/ is rounded (that's not on the vowel chart, but the author thereof says so) and lower than open-mid, so it should be transcribed /ɒ/ (phonetically it is [ɒ̝̈], pretty much the same as Hungarian /ɒ/).

Anyway, try to find Gimson's Pronunciation of English, 8th edition (the latest one). You can borrow it from a library, or buy it, if you have plenty of money (it's not so cheap): http://www.empik.com/gimson-s-pronunciation-of-english-cruttenden-alan,p1080465891,ksiazka-p


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