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different arabic dialects - UniLang

different arabic dialects

Moderator: eskandar

What is you most favorite dialect?

MSA/Classic
11
33%
Egypt
7
21%
Syria/Lebanon
5
15%
gulf
2
6%
Tunisian
1
3%
algerian
3
9%
Bedawi
1
3%
Iraqi
1
3%
Yemen
1
3%
Sudanese
1
3%
 
Total votes: 33

M_Adam
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different arabic dialects

Postby M_Adam » 2013-06-18, 9:35

#sorry if i forgot to add the other dialect it was lazy from me :)

السلام عليكم

although arabic is one language, But the long distance between arabic countries and some of the External factors, made every country gain a unique dialect.
and here is some of the dialects


إختلاف اللهجات العربيه عن بعضها ناتج عن بعد المسافات بين الدول وبعض العوامل الخارجية كأحتلال الدول الاستعماريه سابقاً والذى أكسب بعض هذ الدول لهجه خاصه بها.



The most common dialect the Egyptian arabic one because only Egypt was producing entertainment on the arabic region for a long time
like movies songs...etc

but people has there one preference among these dialect

and here is some of is difference among these dialects

arabic dialects.png


You can't learn these dialect effectively unless you live in the country you would like to learn the dialect from
or interact with people from these countries
some site provides free connections with people from all over the world
and some provide some paid training to train with native teacher.

good luck :D

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Last edited by M_Adam on 2013-06-25, 11:37, edited 1 time in total.
Fluent arabic
Excellent english
some french and Japanese.

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby Meera » 2013-06-18, 18:56

My favorites are Lebanese and Eygptian.
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby shprakh » 2013-06-18, 20:45

I voted Lebanese and Egyptian.

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby linguoboy » 2013-06-18, 22:54

My second-favourite (Bedawi) wasn't on the list.
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby mōdgethanc » 2013-06-19, 0:24

Neither were Iraqi nor Yemen.

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby linguoboy » 2013-06-19, 0:56

mōdgethanc wrote:Neither were Iraqi nor Yemen.

Image
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby mōdgethanc » 2013-06-19, 3:10

linguoboy wrote:
mōdgethanc wrote:Neither were Iraqi nor Yemeni.

Image
FTFY

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby Meera » 2013-06-20, 6:36

Neither was Morrocan Lol
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby mōdgethanc » 2013-06-20, 8:12

Meera wrote:Neither was Morrocan Lol
This isn't really on topic but I got into a bit of an argument the other day with one of my friends (the one who wants me to study Arabic with him). He grew up speaking Sudanese Arabic and insists Arabic is one language while I was arguing it's more like a language family because not all its varieties are mutually intellgible. He claims they are but I highly doubt a Moroccan and a Lebanese person could converse in their dialects without using some words borrowed from MSA or maybe Egyptian Arabic. A Lebanese friend I used to talk to who taught me some Arabic also told me he can understand Egyptians thanks to movies but Moroccan is nearly impossible to understand.

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby languagepotato » 2013-06-20, 11:04

mōdgethanc wrote:
Meera wrote:Neither was Morrocan Lol
This isn't really on topic but I got into a bit of an argument the other day with one of my friends (the one who wants me to study Arabic with him). He grew up speaking Sudanese Arabic and insists Arabic is one language while I was arguing it's more like a language family because not all its varieties are mutually intellgible. He claims they are but I highly doubt a Moroccan and a Lebanese person could converse in their dialects without using some words borrowed from MSA or maybe Egyptian Arabic. A Lebanese friend I used to talk to who taught me some Arabic also told me he can understand Egyptians thanks to movies but Moroccan is nearly impossible to understand.


i think you're right with nearly impossible.
if i spoke to someone from lebanon, 'would you want to drink coffee and eat fish?', he'd understand: 'blah blah drink coffee, blah blah eat whale?'
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby linguoboy » 2013-06-20, 12:37

mōdgethanc wrote:He grew up speaking Sudanese Arabic and insists Arabic is one language while I was arguing it's more like a language family because not all its varieties are mutually intellgible.

Don't we think of German as "one language"? Where's the substantial difference except that after a century and a half of universal education a higher percentage (i.e. nearly all) of "German-speakers" are fully conversant in the prestige variety?
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby mōdgethanc » 2013-06-20, 12:48

linguoboy wrote:Don't we think of German as "one language"? Where's the substantial difference except that after a century and a half of universal education a higher percentage (i.e. nearly all) of "German-speakers" are fully conversant in the prestige variety?
Actually, no, I don't. Standard German is one language, sure. Swiss German and Low German are at the very least not the same language to me. I don't know much about the various High German dialects of Germany but I'm agnostic on whether they are or not until I see evidence for either side. If they have their own written forms and literature and (most importantly) their speakers feel they are not the same language, then they aren't. Besides, haven't a lot of German dialects been displaced by Standard German?

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby linguoboy » 2013-06-20, 13:06

mōdgethanc wrote:and (most importantly) their speakers feel they are not the same language
mōdgethanc wrote:He grew up speaking Sudanese Arabic and insists Arabic is one language
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby mōdgethanc » 2013-06-20, 16:00

Oh, so he represents all Arabic speakers? I'll tell him that.

I have no problem seeing Arabic as a macrolanguage as long as we acknowledge that its varieties are quite distinct. The real issue is that he insisted all Arabic dialects are mutually intelligible. That's not what other natives have told me, and I highly doubt it's the case.

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby Meera » 2013-06-20, 17:05

mōdgethanc wrote:
Meera wrote:Neither was Morrocan Lol
This isn't really on topic but I got into a bit of an argument the other day with one of my friends (the one who wants me to study Arabic with him). He grew up speaking Sudanese Arabic and insists Arabic is one language while I was arguing it's more like a language family because not all its varieties are mutually intellgible. He claims they are but I highly doubt a Moroccan and a Lebanese person could converse in their dialects without using some words borrowed from MSA or maybe Egyptian Arabic. A Lebanese friend I used to talk to who taught me some Arabic also told me he can understand Egyptians thanks to movies but Moroccan is nearly impossible to understand.


Linguoboy and Lanuagepotato probably could explain this better than me because I don't know a lot about Arabic but I'm going to base this off of what native speakers have told me. Most Arabic speakers consider Arabic one language, whenever I talk to a native speaker this seems to be the case. Both of my two Arabic teachers drilled this into our head that it is one language and genereally all the native speakers have said the same thing to me. For example I went to a Lebanese resturant and asked the waitress in my awful Lebanaese dialect, "Do you speak Lebanese Arabic?" and she answeared "No, I speak Arabic." I've only ever talked to two Morrocans in Arabic and when I talked to them they made themselves sound more Egyptian and MSA and slowed down while talking so I could understand them. I don't if all Morrocans can do this though. I mean I am no where fluent in Arabic, but I can understand why they do consider it one language. If you study MSA you can deffintly see where the words come from and when broken down you can see how they relate. For example, Egyptian "da" and "di" comes from Hadha and Hadhihi. Or in Lebanese "hayda/haydi". I don't know if I would consider it the same language, but I can see why Arabs do. To be honest, I think Arabic is a lot like English dialects. When I was in South Carolina and Georgia I could not undertsand anything anyone said, I actually had to ask a couple people to write things down for me, because I could not make it out. I have trouble understanding people from Scotland and Ireland also, and even some parts of England I can't understand at all. But it is still considered the same language.
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby linguoboy » 2013-06-20, 17:32

mōdgethanc wrote:Oh, so he represents all Arabic speakers?

In Meera's experience and mine, yes, at least on this point. If you've got testimony from native speakers which supports the notion that they see Arabic as several distinct languages rather than only one, well, don't be shy about showing it to us.

So far, the only Arabic-speaking group I've come across which advocates this view is a nationalistic minority of Christian-identified Lebanese Arabic-speakers. (See for instance: http://www.lebaneselanguage.org/.) The views of my best Arabic-speaking friend (I'm sure I've talked about him before--a Bahraini Muslim with a Syrian parent) couldn't be more different on this score. Like Meera, he's conversed with Iraqis, Moroccans, and everyone inbetween, and they all share his insistence that they're speaking some form of the "same language".
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby mōdgethanc » 2013-06-20, 17:52

mōdgethanc wrote:I have no problem seeing Arabic as a macrolanguage as long as we acknowledge that its varieties are quite distinct. The real issue is that he insisted all Arabic dialects are mutually intelligible. That's not what other natives have told me, and I highly doubt it's the case.

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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby Meera » 2013-06-20, 19:15

linguoboy wrote:So far, the only Arabic-speaking group I've come across which advocates this view is a nationalistic minority of Christian-identified Lebanese Arabic-speakers. (See for instance: http://www.lebaneselanguage.org/.)


I've noticed this with Lebanese Christian speakers too or in a lot of casses they only want to speak French. Sometimes they tell me they know French better than Arabic, which I don't is true or if they just say it to sound cultured or something.

Also mōdgethanc, I think the LDI classifies them as diffirent languages, on the GLOSS website they have diffirent sections for each Arabic. For example this is how they word it : "Arabic-MSA, Arabic-Egyptian, Arabic-Levantine, Arabic- Iraqi".
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby mōdgethanc » 2013-06-20, 20:28

Meera wrote:Also mōdgethanc, I think the LDI classifies them as diffirent languages, on the GLOSS website they have diffirent sections for each Arabic. For example this is how they word it : "Arabic-MSA, Arabic-Egyptian, Arabic-Levantine, Arabic- Iraqi".
I just looked at it and it just says "Egyptian", "Levantine" and "Sudanese". But that doesn't necessarily mean they're classified as different languages because there are also different pages for "Korean" and "North Korean" (wtf?).

Anyway, as I said this isn't really about whether varieties of Arabic are dialects or languages. That's a really pointless discussion to get into anyway since there is no objective way to tell either way. The point I was trying to make to my friend was that they're about as different as the Romance languages are and just learning MSA (which is what he wanted me to do) wouldn't mean I could talk to any Arab in their native tongue. He said Arabic isn't any different from another language in terms of how much variety it has, which I disagree with since I've never come across an English accent I couldn't understand without a little work, except for English-based creoles (which are not really like English at all) and to some extent Scots.

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linguoboy
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Re: different arabic dialects

Postby linguoboy » 2013-06-20, 21:32

mōdgethanc wrote:The point I was trying to make to my friend was that they're about as different as the Romance languages are and just learning MSA (which is what he wanted me to do) wouldn't mean I could talk to any Arab in their native tongue. He said Arabic isn't any different from another language in terms of how much variety it has, which I disagree with since I've never come across an English accent I couldn't understand without a little work, except for English-based creoles (which are not really like English at all) and to some extent Scots.

And it sounds to me like he's saying he's never come across an Arabic accent he couldn't understand with a little work. The crucial difference with the Romance languages is the there's no common high register comparable to MSA or Standard English which has influenced them all and which all educated speakers will have some command of. Perhaps French played something of that role two centuries ago, but it didn't last.

Obviously not all languages show the same degree of variation because the definition of "language" itself is so arbitrary. But in fact there are other dialect continua with an internal diversity comparable to Arabic which are nevertheless widely considered one language and not a family of languages. I read his point as being that Arabic isn't as much of a special case you make it out to be (in anything, I think it's English which is somewhat unusual in the relative weakness of its traditional dialects) and I agree with that.

[*] It's also likely that he's not aware of how much accommodation other speakers are making when they talk to them, which is understandable. I made the same mistake with Swiss-German. I remember once talking to a Swiss and thinking, "Wow, I can finally understand Schwyzerdütsch!", an illusion which was dashed the moment she turned and spoke to one of her companions. It wasn't "real" dialect she'd been speaking to me but dialect-coloured Standarddeutsch.
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons


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