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Sveiki - Page 4 - UniLang

Sveiki

Moderator: Sol Invictus

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Cesare M.
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Re: Sveiki

Postby Cesare M. » 2011-12-06, 21:56

n/a
Last edited by Cesare M. on 2011-12-07, 13:44, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby linguoboy » 2011-12-06, 22:01

Cesare M. wrote:
Sol Invictus wrote:How about translating The white lion for me

Balta lauva - The white lion

(Psst! Use the definite adjective ending. You know--just like you would in Lithuanian!)
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Sol Invictus » 2011-12-06, 22:07

And after applying that hint to correct your mistake try

The white lion had white cubs
I speak:  (lv) (en) I understand some:  (de) (ru) Toying with:  (es)

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Cesare M. » 2011-12-06, 22:11

n/a
Last edited by Cesare M. on 2011-12-07, 13:44, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby linguoboy » 2011-12-06, 22:13

Cesare M. wrote:
linguoboy wrote:
Cesare M. wrote:
Sol Invictus wrote:How about translating The white lion for me

Balta lauva - The white lion

(Psst! Use the definite adjective ending. You know--just like you would in Lithuanian!)

Ok, balti lauva bija balti mazuļi

I have to ask you again--and not to be "mean" but because it seems we're speaking at cross purposes--do you understand what the grammatical terminology used here and on those pages actually means? Can you define the terms "definite", "plural", and "accusative"? (Just in a few words of your own; we don't need a dictionary definition.)
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Cesare M. » 2011-12-06, 22:17

n/a
Last edited by Cesare M. on 2012-01-03, 1:53, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Sol Invictus » 2011-12-06, 22:19

The end of the version linguaboy quoted was correct. And I expected you would get the first sentence I asked right first and then translate this. Have you looked at masculine definite endings at all?

And now it starts to look Lithuanian again
I speak:  (lv) (en) I understand some:  (de) (ru) Toying with:  (es)

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Cesare M. » 2011-12-06, 22:25

n/a
Last edited by Cesare M. on 2011-12-07, 13:46, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby linguoboy » 2011-12-06, 22:29

Cesare M. wrote:definite means "the"
plural means "more than one"
accusative is a direct object ex. I eat the meal

So why, when asked to use a definite masculine singular ending do you use an indefinite masculine plural? This is what I mean about cross purposes. There's a real disconnect between what we tell you you need to pay attention to and what you end up doing.
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Re: Sveiki

Postby Cesare M. » 2011-12-06, 22:33

n/a
Last edited by Cesare M. on 2011-12-07, 13:45, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Sol Invictus » 2011-12-06, 22:35

Cesare, first of all, if you are told that a certain thing is right why don't you use it? And secondly why the fuck did you turn lion into first declination word?

Edit: baltais is the right nominative, so we could assume you have general idea about what the first translation should be
Last edited by Sol Invictus on 2011-12-06, 22:38, edited 3 times in total.
I speak:  (lv) (en) I understand some:  (de) (ru) Toying with:  (es)

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Re: Sveiki

Postby linguoboy » 2011-12-06, 22:35

Cesare M. wrote:Baltais lauvs bija balto mazuļju

So what do you think this sentence says?
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

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Re: Sveiki

Postby linguoboy » 2011-12-06, 22:37

Sol Invictus wrote:Cesare, first of all, if you are told that a certain thing is right why don't you use it? And secondly why the fuck did you turn lion into first declination word?

Obviously he still hasn't grasped the difference between "gender" and "declension".
Nepārprotami viņš vēl neaptver atšķirību starp "dzimtes" un "deklinācijas".

I'd put in some links if I thought there were any chance he'd read the articles.
Last edited by linguoboy on 2011-12-06, 22:46, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sveiki

Postby mak » 2011-12-06, 22:37

Before continuing we should agree on the gender of lauva :) I guess it can be both feminine and masculine but to simplify things in this thread we should pretend that it's only feminine. Baltā lauva is perfectly correct.

In English definiteness is expressed by using articles (a, an are the indefinite articles, the is the definite article). In Latvian there are no articles but we still have the concept of definiteness. Adjectives can have indefinite and definite endings. There is no difference between "a sheep" and "the sheep" in Latvian (in both cases it's aita) but there is a difference between "a white sheep" (balta aita) and "the white sheep" (baltā aita). So, when you use the definite article in English you'd also use the definite endings with adjectives, and when you use the indefinite articles you should use the indefinite adjective endings.

Indefinite adjective endings are the same endings that I (masculine) or IV (feminine) declension nouns have. Definite adjective endings are different. Personally I like this table very much.

Let's say you want to describe the noun aita (singular/vienskaitlis, nominative/nominatīvs/N.) with the adjective balts (the root is balt). aita is a IV declension noun which means that it's feminine. Adjectives must agree in gender so the adjective must have feminine (sieviešu dzimte) endings. Now locate the endings: vienskaitlis / sieviešu dzimte / nominatīvs. There are two possibilities: -a (indefinite/nenot.g.) and -ā (definite/not.g.). So a white sheep is balta aita and the white sheep is baltā aita. Now try the plural endings: daudzskaitlis / sieviešu dzimte / nominatīvs: -as, -ās. white sheep is baltas aitas and the white sheep is baltās aitas.

To practice try translating these sentences:

The white flowers. (balts, puķe)
Black socks. (melns, zeķe)
Blue eye. (zils, acs)
Blue eyes. (zils, acs)
Tasty honey. (garšīgs, medus)
Loyal friend. (uzticams, draugs)
The best friends. (labāks, draugs)
The little brother. (mazs, brālis)

Also, please describe which declension nouns you think they are and which gender they are and describe how you found the endings you used.

(When you can do these, I'll give you other sentences in other cases)
Last edited by mak on 2011-12-06, 23:10, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Sol Invictus » 2011-12-06, 22:40

the f word is lauvene, don't give him excuses
I speak:  (lv) (en) I understand some:  (de) (ru) Toying with:  (es)

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mak
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Re: Sveiki

Postby mak » 2011-12-06, 22:43

It's just that it's very confusing for him. Can we pick another animal? I propose kaza (goat). I think we all agree it's feminine.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Sol Invictus » 2011-12-06, 22:45

The difference between genders in "feminine" declensions occurs only in dative. I mentioned the gender because there is difference between correct adjective endings, which we want him to learn, right? Let him translate sentence about lion having cubs properly and then we can forget the lions
Last edited by Sol Invictus on 2011-12-06, 22:51, edited 1 time in total.
I speak:  (lv) (en) I understand some:  (de) (ru) Toying with:  (es)

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Cesare M. » 2011-12-06, 22:48

n/a
Last edited by Cesare M. on 2011-12-07, 12:40, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sveiki

Postby linguoboy » 2011-12-06, 22:52

mak wrote:So a white sheep is balta aita and the shite sheep is baltā aita.

Wouldn't that be "sūdu aita"?

Sol Invictus wrote:Let him translate sentence about lion having cubs properly and then we can forget the lions

You might as well just spin a roulette wheel until someone tells you to stop. That's apparently all he does.
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

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Re: Sveiki

Postby Cesare M. » 2011-12-06, 22:55

n/a
Last edited by Cesare M. on 2011-12-07, 12:41, edited 1 time in total.


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