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Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian - Page 32 - UniLang

Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

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Roger
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Roger » 2012-12-31, 15:11

It's already very close.

The words kandma and vendluse... Try to make the n a bit longer, more like kanndma and venndluse.
Your kõik sounded like something between kõik and kõõik but the võrdsetena was very good.
In südametunnistus try to palatalise the first n too.

But in overall it is quite good. (y)

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ainurakne
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-02, 12:37

Hmm, interesting... from your accent I wouldn't have guessed that your native language is Finnish (although the lack of palatalization hinted it - Finnish consonants are even more "unpalatalized" than unpalatalized Estonian ones). Your (voiceless) consonants are a bit harsh - try to pull them more "to the background" and give a bit "more room" to the vowels (and voiced consonants).

I guess for a Finn the hardest part in Estonian pronunciation (besides the three quantities) is palatalization. The general rule seems to be roughly like this: if consonants l, n, s, d, t or their compounds are immediately followed by i (which may not be visible in nominative case and some short plural forms) then these consonants are usually palatalized. Otherwise they are (usually) not. But of course the safest bet is to always look it from the dictionary.

But overall you are doing great, most of your õ-s sounded also native.
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Lumekuninganna
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Lumekuninganna » 2013-01-07, 22:34

I recently attempted to translate a song that I'm sure I butchered, but two words I really couldn't figure out in context:

Obesed joodetud
kammitud ka
hellaste loodetud
küll rammitud ka

hommik on heinane
ja lahkuvad väed

All I can find for 'rammitud' is its meaning of 'rammed' from 'rammima'.
And 'heinane' keeps coming back to the word 'hey', but it looks like an adjective?

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ainurakne
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-08, 0:29

rammitud - I am as puzzled as you are, since it really seems to be the past particle of rammima. But anyway, my guesses (of what it could possibly mean) are:
  • rammitud = rammed: 'hobustele on (uued) rauad alla löödud(/rammitud)' = (new) horse-shoes are attached to their feet
  • rammitud = rammless (plural): although this meaning would not make much sense
  • since this song is (partly) in somekind of dialect, then there may be a slight possibility, that rammitud may be somekind of verb form of an older word ramm (declinates: ramm, rammu, .rammu) or rammusus, which are associated with physical strength and well-fededness(?) - so, it may just mean that the horses are already fed.
  • It just rhymes...

heinane - yep, it's the "adjectivified" form of hein (hey), compare:
vihm (rain) - vihmane (rainy)
muda (mud) - mudane (muddy)
etc...
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Lumekuninganna » 2013-01-08, 18:57

ainurakne wrote:[*]since this song is (partly) in somekind of dialect, then there may be a slight possibility, that rammitud may be somekind of verb form of an older word ramm (declinates: ramm, rammu, .rammu) or rammusus, which are associated with physical strength and well-fededness(?) - so, it may just mean that the horses are already fed.[/*]


Ahh, I wondered if it could mean this too! I had found this explanation in an online dictionary:

kõnek (hrl. loomade kohta:) rammusus, lihavus. Lehm paranes ja hakkas rammu võtma. Sead söövad hästi ja lähevad ruttu rammu. *Võetakse [lehm] ära karjast, katsutakse nuumata, kuid visa on tulema ta ramm ning kondisena ta siis tapetaksegi.

But I thought it was incorrect because of the rammu~ form, when rammitud is rammi~. Perhaps it still relates because of the dialect, like you said, or maybe it just indeed rhymes. :)

ainurakne wrote:heinane - yep, it's the "adjectivified" form of hein (hey), compare:
vihm (rain) - vihmane (rainy)
muda (mud) - mudane (muddy)
etc...


Honestly, I'm still confused about this, then, because I can't find an English equivalent:

hein (hay) - heinane (hay-y? (haha) ...hay-like? hay-filled?)

(I misspelled 'hay' originally. :) )

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-08, 22:33

Lumekuninganna wrote:But I thought it was incorrect because of the rammu~ form, when rammitud is rammi~. Perhaps it still relates because of the dialect, like you said, or maybe it just indeed rhymes. :)
I tried to search a bit more this rammi~ stem and from Võro dictionary I found this:
  • .ram'ma, .rammiq, rammi rühmama, rügama ~ to work hard
From dialectical dictionary I found:
  • rambima (rammima ramma) "<raugema rammestama
  • rammima "<trampima
  • rammima "jõudu katsuma
  • rammissama "kriimustama
  • rammistama (ramistama) "rammestama
  • rammistus "rammestus
  • rammitama "rammestama
  • rammitsemma "lonkama
  • rammitus "rammestus
Since most of these words are associated with rammestus (~tiredness), then I guess that this word in the song could be actually rammetud, which is plural of rammetu - which would mean that the horses are tired, weak, have run out of strength.
But again, I am not completely sure if this really is correct or not.

Lumekuninganna wrote:Honestly, I'm still confused about this, then, because I can't find an English equivalent:

hein (hay) - heinane (hay-y? (haha) ...hay-like? hay-filled?)

(I misspelled 'hay' originally. :) )
Well, I don't remember hearing this before in Estonian either, but I would use this word for example in a context like this:
If you roll yourself in hay, then your clothes and hair will become hay-y (covered with hay, get hay stuck in them) in the same way as they will become dusty (tolmune) in this situation (get covered with hay dust).
But I guess full of hay could be also acceptable translation.
hay-like should be heinjas in my opinion (although it sounds really weird).
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Lumilintu » 2013-01-13, 23:25

Kas keegi teist oskab soovitada mõnda head eestikeelset raamatut?

Ma mõtlen just eesti autorite omad, kuna olen tähele pannud, et loen enamasti tõlkekirjandust ja kuidagi hakkas kahju sellest, et ma eesti kaasaegsest kirjandusest suurt midagi ei tea.
Aga samas ei tea ka, kust otsast alustada...
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-14, 10:56

Ausalt öeldes, ega ise eriti palju ei loegi :oops: Kohaliku kirjandusega sai ka viimati tõsisemalt kokku puututud kooli ajal, mil selle lugemine kohustuslik oli.

Aga kaasaegsest Eesti kirjandusest tuleb minul esimese asjana hetkel meelde Andrus Kiviräha teos "Rehepapp" (või "Rehepapp ehk November"), mis mulle väga meeldis; ning on parajalt naljakas ka. Aga eks ta ole muudki põnevat kirjutanud - alles jäi mulle lehest silma, et tema romaanil "Mees, kes teadis ussisõnu" pidi Prantsusmaal päris hästi minema.
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Lumilintu » 2013-01-14, 15:29

ainurakne wrote:Kohaliku kirjandusega sai ka viimati tõsisemalt kokku puututud kooli ajal, mil selle lugemine kohustuslik oli.

Sama siin.

Kivirähka ma isegi tean, kuigi olen seni lugenud ainult üks tema teostest, nimelt "Kaka ja kevad". :D
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-14, 19:04

Lumilintu wrote:Kivirähka ma isegi tean, kuigi olen seni lugenud ainult üks tema teostest, nimelt "Kaka ja kevad". :D
:lol:
Kas sa pead silmas seda lühijuttu või samanimelist "muinasjuttude" kogumikku? Seda viimast polnud ma tegelikult varem näinudki.
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Lumilintu » 2013-01-14, 21:08

Pidasin silmas lasteraamatut, ehk siis "muinasjuttude" kogumikku.Seda leidub vist igas raamatupoes.
Ja tegelikult oli seda tõesti päris huvitav lugeda. :D
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Roger » 2013-01-16, 13:05

Soovitaksin ühte novellikest pealkirjaga "Popi ja Huhuu" (Friedebert Tuglas).
http://www.litterature-estonienne.com/t ... piest.html

Kui soovid aga head kaasaegset lühemat lugemist, siis soovitaksin Kristian Kirsfeldt'i blogi. Väga andekas tüüp.
Viimased postitused jäta alguses vahele. Paremad lood on näiteks:
http://luulekeskagentuur.blogspot.com/2 ... iisor.html (viimane televiisor)
http://luulekeskagentuur.blogspot.com/2 ... hvlid.html (šokolaaditrühvlid)
http://luulekeskagentuur.blogspot.com/2 ... eenid.html (aborigeenid)
http://luulekeskagentuur.blogspot.com/2 ... kodus.html (ärge proovige seda kodus!)

:)

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Algernon » 2013-01-20, 22:14

Having trouble with "Esimest korda võla see dialoog et Raadio 4 eetris 2005." ... or did I not hear it correctly? (My first post.... :) )
[flag]sco[/flag] English but can do this :-) [flag]et[/flag] trying [flag]fr[/flag] School long time ago

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-21, 8:59

Algernon wrote:Having trouble with "Esimest korda võla see dialoog et Raadio 4 eetris 2005." ... or did I not hear it correctly? (My first post.... :) )
Welcome to the forum :)

Maybe it was "Esimest korda kõlas see dialoog Raadio 4 eetris 2005.", which means roughly "First time was this dialog on the air of Radio 4 in 2005". But I can't figure out that "et" - it's usually (subordinating) that, but it doesn't fit here nor does it resemble any other word that could fit here.

EDIT: on second thought, this "et" could be also "ehk", which is sometimes used as "maybe".
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Algernon » 2013-01-21, 18:38

Esimest korda kõlas see dialoog Raadio 4 eetris 2005.

Wonder how I could post the sound file or link to it.... :? ("Extension .wma not allowed" when I try to upload attachment :( )
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-22, 10:15

Algernon wrote:Wonder how I could post the sound file or link to it.... :? ("Extension .wma not allowed" when I try to upload attachment :( )
Well, if it doesn't contain any copyrighted material (like music, which you can cut out), then you can upload it here for example. And then link it using the URL tag (or button).
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Algernon » 2013-01-22, 11:59

ainurakne wrote:
Algernon wrote:Wonder how I could post the sound file or link to it.... :? ("Extension .wma not allowed" when I try to upload attachment :( )
Well, if it doesn't contain any copyrighted material (like music, which you can cut out), then you can upload it here for example. And then link it using the URL tag (or button).


Wonder if this will work:

http://vocaroo.com/i/s17FQCy3ZNnM
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-22, 15:34

Yes, it does (I hope I got all the names correctly):
Naljaga pooleks

Naljaga pooleks - eesti keele õppekomplekt algtasemele
Autorid: Mare Kitsnik ja Vello Kingissepp
Fonogrammi tootja: Eesti Raadio

Dialooge esitavad Maria Klenskaja ja Lembit Ulfsak
Väljendeid loeb Meelis Kompus
Helirežissöör: Ingrid Jans

Esimest korda kõlasid dialoogid Raadio 4 eetris 2005. aastal
About the numbers here:
  • 4 - nelja = of four (genitive case)
  • 2005. - kahe tuhande viiendal = on(/at) 2005th

Esimest korda kõlasid dialoogid Raadio 4 eetris 2005. aastal ~ The dialogues were first aired on Radio 4 in 2005.
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away

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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby Algernon » 2013-01-23, 10:47

Naljaga pooleks help:

Suur, suur tänu seda eest :)

Oh, see on Leelo Kingisepp, ilmselt (mul on raamat :wink: )
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Re: Küsimus eesti keele kohta / Questions about Estonian

Postby ainurakne » 2013-01-23, 16:00

Algernon wrote:Suur, suur tänu selle eest :)
Võta heaks! :)
Algernon wrote:Oh, see on Leelo Kingisepp, ilmselt (mul on raamat :wink: )
On jah "Leelo". Ei tea, miks ma "Vello" kuulsin :oops:
Eesti keel (et) native, English (en) I can manage, Suomi (fi) trying to learn, Pусский (ru)&Deutsch (de) unfortunately, slowly fading away


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